Timothy Tyndall - Director - Camp Internet: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 9:21AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Timothy Tyndall - Director - Camp Internet: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 9:24AM PST (-0800 GMT)
A very interesting article on Rock Art titled The Shamanic Tradition in Chumash Rock Art by
William D. Hyder and Georgia Lee is located in Camp Internet at: button
Timothy Tyndall - Director - Camp Internet: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 9:27AM PST (-0800 GMT)
There is some good video in the Camp Internet video library that reviews rock art. Goto: button and select "Between Two Worlds the Rock Art of the Cosos". Look around in the video library for other videos on rock art and the Chumash people.
Timothy Tyndall - Director - Camp Internet: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 9:30AM PST (-0800 GMT)
The Camp Internet GIS map has information on student and teacher Field Trips to Painted Caves and other places. Take some time to review the GIS map and look at the field reports from Painted Cave. Goto: button and select the Camp Internet GIS map. Also in the GIS library is a new American History GIS map that will tell you about the Culture Areas where much of the rock art is found. Goto the same location as for the Camp Internet GIS and select the American History GIS map.
Camp Internet Rock Art Explorers: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 10:07AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Rock Art from Baja California 
...Se more in our new rock art gallery at button
Camp Internet Rock Art Explorers: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 10:07AM PST (-0800 GMT)
From the Coso in Eastern California
Camp Internet Rock Art Explorers: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 10:08AM PST (-0800 GMT)
From the Ancient Southwest in Utah 
Camp Internet Rock Art Explorers: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 10:12AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Questions received before the session: Did children ever make the rock art? ........ Were the rock art sites visited by everyone in their tribe ? ...... Or were they only visited as part of special ceremonies? ..... Did they make any similar images on other objects that they lived with in their villages? ....... What tools did they use to make the painted and pecked images? What countries around the world have ancient rock art?
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:08AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Welcome. I'll try to answer your questions as best I can. Be patient. I'll get to them.
Did children make rock art? Probably not, at least not what you see in books and in parks. Some rock art in Southern California was made by boys and girls in ceremonies where they passed from being a child to being an adult. But, those are the only documented cases we have.
Laura E, 5th grade: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:09AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Dr. Hyder - how did you get interested in rock art?
Roger McD, 5th grade: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:09AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Can you go to school and study rock art in college ?
Vera Lyons, 5th grade: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:10AM PST (-0800 GMT)
What places have you gone to that have rock art ?
Morgana - 5th grade: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:11AM PST (-0800 GMT)
What is the biggest rock art painting in the world and where is it?
Eddis Torres, St Andrews: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:11AM PST (-0800 GMT)
What makes the paint stay on the rock for so many years?
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:11AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Who visited rock art sites and when? Again, we are making our best guess based on the archaeological remains found at sites and what we know from living people who made rock art. Some sites are in remote locations and were likely visited only for the purpose of ceremonies. Other sites are in villages and could be seen by anyone from many different places in the village. So rock art was created for many different purposes.
Tally - 2th grade - Paradise Home School: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:12AM PST (-0800 GMT)
What is the oldest Chumash painting? Is it in Santa Barbara?
Alma Velasquez, St. Andrews: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:12AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Were the paintings done all at once on a wall, or did they add to them over time?
Tally - 2th grade - Paradise Home School: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:13AM PST (-0800 GMT)
What is the one picture / image that is found the most in rock art?
Ayami - 9th grade - Paradise Home School: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:14AM PST (-0800 GMT)
What is your favorite Chusmash rock art painting?
Marcy, Camp Internet: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:15AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Do scientists have any idea why there is very little rock art out on the Channel Islands yet such elaborate rock art on the mainland? Were there groups with in the Chumash who did not do rock art?
Gilbert/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:15AM PST (-0800 GMT)
We have arrived and have questions.
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:15AM PST (-0800 GMT)
I got interested in rock art when I bought a book for my brother-in-law for Christmas. He is an artist and I thought he would like the book. I read it and became interested myself. Once I visited my first rock art site, I was hooked. I studied archaeology to learn more about people and how to study them from their buried artifacts. I apply that knowledge to the study rock art. I have been lucky enough to have visited sites throughout the western United States, Easter Island, Australia, and the caves of France.
Ayami - 9th grade - Paradise Home School: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:16AM PST (-0800 GMT)
What Culture uses / has used rock art the most?
Sammy Evans, St andrews: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:16AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Why did they make the paintings ?
Wood/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:17AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Are the hands on the wall a symbol for something in the Southwest rock art? Were they the hands of children or adults?
Marcy, Camp Internet: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:17AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Campers - remember to tell us what school you are from in the 'Your Handle' box along with your names.
Morgana - 5th grade - Paradise Homeschool: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:17AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Have any rock art paintings been found which refer to Atlantis?
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:20AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Everyone is interested in the biggest paintings or rock art sites. Big rock art sites occur everywhere in the world. If there are rocks, you will find rock art. Some of the big sites in California are found in the Coso Range in the California desert, Lava Beds National Monument on the Oregon border, and at Painted Rock--a Chumash site on the edge of the Central Valley.
My favorite Chumash site is called Arrowhead Springs behind Santa Barbara/Goleta. It is actually quite small and that adds to its beauty. It is a nive place to sit, listen to the spring and the wind in the trees, and enjoy the delicate paintings. It is quite peaceful. There are many small paintings, one on top of the other, and I think they were made by different people over several hundred years.
Basham/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:20AM PST (-0800 GMT)
It looks like the Anasazi used spray paint for the hands like a stencil. Are they engraved or painted?
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:24AM PST (-0800 GMT)
The paint used to make rock art is usually an earth pigment. That means it does not fade in the sun, otherwise there would be no color in the earth. But, painting does erode away with wind, rain, and people touching it. Some rock is very good to hold a pinting and other rock wears away rapidly. The different kinds of rock found in different areas or at places like the Channel Islands, contributes to the survival of rock art. The rock on the Channel Islands is not a good rock for art to last a long time.
But, people carved on shell and whale bone and wood. There were many articles that we would call art in people's daily lives. Rock art is only one small part.
Foster/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:25AM PST (-0800 GMT)
What kind of rocks did the Chumash painton in the Channel Islands?
Carroll/offman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:25AM PST (-0800 GMT)
It seems
Bock/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:27AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Did they use a specific kind of rock or shell to draw on?
Brunn/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:30AM PST (-0800 GMT)
What did the Chumash use on the Channel Islands to get such beautiful colors?
Carroll/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:31AM PST (-0800 GMT)
It seems like the Chumash art is mostly based on a circle with spokes. Is there meaning in the spokes? When were the Chumash introduced to the wheel? Who might have introduced them to the wheel with spokes?
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:31AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Some of you are interested in hands in the Southwest. Thank you for asking because I had forgotten about children's hand prints in the southwest. I work in Grand Gulch, Utah and cliff houses often have hand prints next to them. These appear to be the hand prints of the people living there, including adults and children. At other places, many people have left their hand prints and the hand prints of what are clearly babies. The hand is very recognizable as a human mark and i suspect people were saying I live here.
Hunt/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:36AM PST (-0800 GMT)
It looks likes the Chumash always used red. Was there a lot of red? Was it available to them? Is there any other reason?
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:38AM PST (-0800 GMT)
People used red ochre (iron oxide, kind of like rust) for red, charcoal for black, yellow ochre for yellow (it turns red if burned), ground shell or gypsum for white, and special stones for green and blue where they occur. Sometimes, they mixed colors to get orange.
Atlantis is not depicted in any paintings because it is only a place in stories. But, people did paint about stories. We probably cannot read them, but the Chumash say that we have hands like a lizard instead of coyote, because lizard was faster than coyote when man was designed. Coyote wanted us to have hands like the coyote paw, but lizard hurried in and gave us hands like his before coyote could act. There is a painting of a lizard and a coyote in the Carrizo Plain with the lizard's hand over the coyote's paw. Could this be a painting of that story?
Marcy, Camp Internet: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:39AM PST (-0800 GMT)
How does star lore find representation in rock art?
Eduardo Ramos St Andrews: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:40AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Were people sepcaily trained to do rock art - only certain guys?
Bev Harris, St Andrews: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:41AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Do the Chumash still do rock art today ?
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:41AM PST (-0800 GMT)
The Chumash spoked wheel is a common Chumash image. It might represent the sun, but it might represent many other things. They did not make wheels. But, the circle image is a common image made by humans everywhere. I suspect that they used this basic form in many different ways to represent many different things. Sometimes, it is clear that they are painting a turtle. In other cases, they are very elaborate designs that are called mandalas in other parts of the world. Elsewhere, they are used to concentrate one's attention in a form of trance or prayer. Maybe the Chumash were doing something similar.
Roger copeland, St Andrews: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:41AM PST (-0800 GMT)
How did they make those huge murals in Baja?
Gilbert/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:42AM PST (-0800 GMT)
That is all of our questions for now. Thank you.
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:48AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Sometimes, we find paintings that are clearly representations of star patterns in the sky. But, there are so many stars in the sky that it is not hard to find a pattern that matches. In some cases, we know that certain stars were important. The Pleides are one example and we do find representations of the Pleides pattern in rock art. If you do not know what that looks like, look at a Subaru car and the design they use to represent Subaru, it is the Pleides. People still use these images for different purposes. That is what makes it hard to know what they really meant when they made the images.
We do not have evidence that people were trained to make rock art, but most rock art is very well done. I suspect that talented people made rock art because they had the talent.
The Chumash do not make rock art today because it is no longer part of their active culture. They changed through the Mission Period when most of their people died of diseases and malnutrition. As their culture changed, somethings were no longer done. Our culture has changed as well. People drew images on rocks in many parts of the country in the 1800s. Today, we think that is a bad thing and has a negative impact on our environment. We have all changed.
Gilbert/Hoffman: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:48AM PST (-0800 GMT)
This information is very interesting
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:54AM PST (-0800 GMT)
Big paintings was an early question. If you were thinking about the Baja murals, then a question about big paintings is interesting. Archaeologists did not know if the Baja artists made scaffolds to reach the top of caves to paint the big paintings or if they used poles with paint brushes on the end. An artist, Elaine Moore, answered this question when studying the paintings. She saw that the paintings are distorted if laid out flat. That means they are smaller at the bottem and bigger at the top so they look even sized when viewed from the ground. She believes that means they were painted with poles and the only view the artist ever saw was from the ground. She also studied the painting itself and the images are compased of broad strokes of paint as one might find from a paint brush on the end of a pole. From the view on the ground, it looks like even painting.
Bill Hyder: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 11:55AM PST (-0800 GMT)
I think I got to everyone's questions. If I missed yours, my apologies. I am pleased to see your interest in rock art.
Marcy, Camp Internet: . . . . Wed, Nov 20, 0:08PM PST (-0800 GMT)
Thanks everyone for the interesting dialogue ! This room will be open for review for a few weeks ahead. All of your great questions and our esteemed guest's very fascinating answers will help many more students learn about this amazing communication form - is rock art perhaps a precursor to the Internet ????